How a Media Startup is Revolutionizing an Entire Industry

00:01
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Kate 00:18
Welcome to startup success. Today we have Griffin O’Brien, the co-founder and CEO of Estate Media in studio. Welcome, Griff.

Griff 00:29
Thank you. Thank you for having me.

Kate 00:31
I’m really excited to have you here. Because you’re really kind of disrupting an industry that’s been around for a long time. But let’s start by if you could share a little bit about your background. And then what led you to the founding of a state media?

Griff 00:46
Yeah, absolutely. So my background is largely in media. So I started right out of college and interning at Starz, the premium cable channel, and really fell in love with content and entertainment and the business behind it. At that time streaming was very nascent, so cable was still dominant, We weren’t really in the period of of structural decline of the cable business, but very interested in it and continued to pursue entertainment internships in college, I started my first company, my junior year of school, which was a digital TV recommendation system, was fortunate to sell that my senior year, and then went into the corporate world and moved to LA after college. I’ve worked at Snapchat, Roku, and Amazon Prime video, all in kind of content acquisition strategy, business development roles. I would say one thing that’s relevant to the founding of this company is, I was generally one of if not the youngest people on my teams at those companies. And so I was very much a product of the social media age YouTubers, etc. And kind of grew up in that space. And so I always found value I could add to more senior executives, right, who knew this business far more than I did was understanding digital, right? And what the convergence between YouTube and the social media creators, right who a lot of these execs knew of tangentially, but didn’t really understand the scale, and the cultural importance they had. And so being able to bring some of those massive talents into the traditional entertainment ecosystem, and what I was at those companies, I started looking at niches within Media from a content acquisition and development perspective, and became super interested in what I would call the professional first creator. And so you know, an individual who has a core business, largely a traditional business – dentists, dermatologists, real estate agents. All of these people, lawyers who have now used right unemployed content, essentially as a top of funnel marketing engine, right for their core business. And it’s so interesting, because these are people who have a ton of intellectual capital and institutional knowledge, but generally don’t have the time or expertise to share that. And so for us when, you know, looking at real estate, right, it’s the perfect example of having tons of big personalities that have incredible properties, right? So there’s a consumer angle, but also have a ton again of stored knowledge and building their careers. And so I fairly serendipitously got introduced to Josh Flagg, who is the star of Million Dollar Listing LA. He’s been on TV now for 15 years. And our third co-founder, Andrew Schoenfeld. And Andrew comes from a private equity and commercial real estate background. Josh, obviously, the residential side, and me with the media background, right, have this conversation about what we saw as an opportunity to build digital and create a destination for the real estate industry and its fans that was video-first and personality first. And so that was really kind of the driving force behind the company to start, there are a lot of real estate publications that were largely text based, right, they’d been around for a long time, they had a high degree of trust, but they were not really tapping into the cultural zeitgeist of a lot of these big real estate personalities. They weren’t really video first, generally were read by let’s say, you know, the top one 10% of the business. And then you had the reality programming, right. And those two things are very different. And so we really wanted to build in the middle and create content that was both entertaining, but also educational and informative, and do so at scale by bringing a lot of these massive personalities together. So that was really, you know, the founding story of the business and how I found my way into real estate.

Kate 04:34
Okay, there’s so many things that you said that caught my attention first, your background I mean, really lends itself so well to this right your media experience then with this social, I can see how you were kind of, you know, thinking outside the box with this. And I love how you described it as professional first creators? That is so smart because as someone who’s been in marketing my whole career, people don’t understand that content can generate so many leads, right when you can use content to drive business. And that’s kind of your competitive advantage, your thought, knowledge, your, your expertise, especially in a digital age where people are looking for information. So I love how you described that and kind of, you know, saw this industry that could use that. That’s so brilliant. So, tell us a little bit more about estate media, because you said something that caught my attention. And that was that you were video first? Which is super interesting to me.

Griff 05:44
Yeah. Look, I completely agree of the professional first creator. Right. And I think the big gap here was that you had a lot of realtors, who were doing a very good job of creating content. But unlike other niches, right, within the Creator landscape, there wasn’t an ecosystem of collaboration and cross promotion. And every creator knows that their core that collaborating with other creators is a key to growth. And so we wanted to take that already proven model and bring it to real estate. But yeah, you know, in terms of video first, like we very much see real estate, it’s such a visual medium, right? Like, everyone likes looking at property, right? Everyone lives in a home of some type. And so we really think that to tell stories in the space that are both geared towards the general public, right kind of the B2C audience that includes buyers and sellers, right about your 12 to 13 million a year in the US round, it includes people who are just interested in looking at real estate, right, whether that’s nice homes. Whether that is the craziest most eclectic homes of which we have creators who profile those. People love the medium of real estate. And so, for us, again, we’re trying to serve what I would call the B2C audience, then also kind of a hardcore B2B audience of being real estate professionals. And so when we look at those two audiences, the content we create, and the mediums we create them for have to be tailored towards who we’re trying to reach. And so certainly right on the B2C side, I think big video concepts that tap into trending topics, whether it’s built around what’s going on culturally, right? If there are, let’s say, homes that are relevant in pop culture, celebrity transactions, etc. These are the kind of high level topics that just the real estate interested consumer generally gravitates towards. And we want to go a layer deeper, right and leverage video storytelling and the big personalities, we have to do that. We’re also very interested though, in the newsletter and education businesses, and I think, you know, newsletters for us, we have five today, they reach several 100,000 people. And those are incredible assets, especially on the B2B side. For us to be able, again, to give more kind of granular information, especially for the real estate professional, that is more conducive, again, to kind of a text based format. So again, we’re very much focused on building across all mediums, including education – masterclasses, in-person events and virtual events. But at our core, we do want to build compelling video, and think that that is really kind of essential to building this flywheel featuring properties and real estate, and showing is better than just kind of talent in this space, right. The best we can do at again, and telling stories visually, right around these properties, I think is going to be most compelling for audiences. And we’ve already seen that to date and some of the early traction of the content we’re making.

Kate 08:36
There are so many things you said there that people could learn from, I really like how you broke it down, that you’re creating content that, you know, matches to the people you want to target, right, which I think for any founder or investor listening, that’s the key to success, right? Sometimes media and other companies can get – It’s like what the founder wants, or you know, your passion or whatever, but it’s a business. So how you broke it down to B2C, and B2B and creating content that kind of moves the needle for both audiences and focusing on video around some of those B2C, hot areas, and then doing the newsletters, some of the more tech space industry kind of things for your B2B market. That’s brilliant.

Griff 09:29
Thank you. No, I appreciate that. And I think, look, it’s still you know, we’re very early on, right and formally launching the platform just within the last month. And so for us, we also need to see signals from our audience, right of what content they like, right and where they’re consuming it. And so, if we’re creating, which we have, right, a pop culture show around, let’s say celebrity transactions, right? We have to be very purposeful of who that audience is. And we have the advantage of knowing that if we’re building right around a creator who already has scale, we know their audience, right? We know who they are, we know who watches them, and where they watch them. And so again, we already have some good data when we go to make a piece of IP as to where we think it’s going to do best for us. So again, it’s like within both B2C and B2B verticals, those are so broad. And so we need to think, and we do very granularly, about, hey, if we’re in the B2B, vertical, even within the realtor segment, you have people who want to become realtors, folks who may have sold their first home, people who are looking to get from 50 to 500 million in sales, and people who are looking to get from 500,000 to a million. So the type of content we create, again, has to be representative of all of those segments within the industry. And so that’s always something we’re thinking about: what is the balance between the content we’re creating? Who are we bringing in? And then again, how do we move, let’s say, the new realtor down funnel from early education into our other products, right, the target, let’s say, the kind of middle realtor, right, or the person who might be kind of early in their career, but as you know, continuing to grow, and then the real estate professional, right, who has already been in the business for a long time, or is trying to get to that next level of sales.

Kate 11:14
I like how and I think, again, everyone listening can learn from this, how you’re constantly then taking feedback, you’re using data points as feedback and what’s driving some of your, in this case, media, but new product developments, right? And so that must be a big part of your process.

Griff 11:33
Yeah, absolutely. And I think, look, views is one thing, right? So you can look at, again, how many views a piece of content is driving? I think what’s interesting, too, is we have this advantage now of working with massive talent, right? Who know their audiences and have to add on who their audiences are. And then also, I think, you know, not just video views, right, and shares and engagement and watch time and completion rates, right, all things that are very interesting and necessary for us to, again, direct our efforts and programming strategy. But we also have the ability to ask questions to our customers, right? And I think that’s so brilliant with newsletters, we can see what people are clicking within the newsletters that we’re putting out. We can test different concepts within these newsletters. We can understand click through rates, right? We have polls and questionnaires we can better understand who our audience is, we allow them to say in each edition of a newsletter we put out, did he love it to be like it to be not to do not like it right and why? And so for us, right? Again, it’s like we’re trying to take some of the guesswork out of that. And fortunately, there’s a lot of great tech now within all of these platforms, that allows us to communicate directly with our customer and consumer and try to then adapt based on the feedback we’re getting.

Kate 12:47
It provides those analytics for you. We talked about transforming the real estate industry, but this is a lot about media. This is a lot about what makes a good media company what you’re practicing.

Griff 13:02
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, look at our core, we are a media business. And I think being in the B2B space, there are certainly points of differentiation, right of how to build a B2B focused media business. For us. though again at the end of the day, right, we are a media company, we’re creating content. And that content ideally, is valuable for both consumers and advertisers. And so really, again, we have the data in front of us, right, we have those signals, and it’s just a matter of, again, taking those into consideration, digesting them and then making those insights actionable, at the end of the day, right, in terms of how we move forward.

Kate 13:38
Right. And talk to me about that a little bit, kind of your whole strategy around advertising. Obviously, you can’t share competitive things, but just like how you’re approaching that.

Griff 13:52
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think part of this business right outside of consumer need for this type of content, was certainly advertiser need. And for us, right, we are able to offer solutions to both endemic real estate advertisers, but also big consumer companies. And so how I look at it is whether we are you know, we’re working with a brand who’s trying to reach realtors who live in this demographic that have this amount of sales, we can do that, right? And we have that data, if we’re trying to reach real estate team leads who have over 100 million in sales, right? We can do that. But if we’re also if an advertiser right is trying to drive awareness, within the talent we have, again, we have this ability of being hyper targeted and granular, but also amongst our talent, we now reach 35 million people. And so very much not just real estate brands, right that we can offer value to but we look at the home and everything around the home, right so luxury brands, automotive, interior design, financial services, insurance, etc. are all trying to reach again, this audience at scale well, and I think, again, we’re doing it in a slightly differentiated way, right, where we’re driving video-first personality-first and we very much saw that the ability to reach influential personalities that spoke to these audiences at scale was very difficult. And I think so far, even the traction we’ve had, with big brands and the revenue, we’ve been able to drive speaks to that there was a need here from an advertiser perspective. And so advertising is certainly one part of our business, the other being, you know, the direct relationship with the consumer. Course, education, memberships, etc. are a big focus for us in 2024, as well.

Kate 15:39
I mean, this is such a great example of how to build a business successfully, and especially, you know, around media. So talk to me a little bit about real estate then and what’s going on in the industry and how it’s changing and how Estate Media wants to be a part of that, because it’s an industry that everybody’s interested in, let’s be honest.

Griff 16:02
Yeah and look, I mean, even two days ago, you saw a $1.8 Billion lawsuit against the National Association of Realtors. There are changes going on constantly. And we started this business, or came up with the idea during COVID. Right, and part of what led us to create this business as you saw that people were moving digitally, right. And obviously COVID was such a catalyst for some industries. But you saw the portals, right, the Zillow and Redfin, Homes.coms of the world we’re seeing, you know, 1000s of percent increase. And part of that obviously, was The Escapist element right of people at home and wanting to look at other places. But also, reimagining what their lives could look like in a potentially remote world. And so for us, we saw that this was only a catalyst for real estate moving digitally. I think the statistic now with Millennials and Gen Z is 98% find their home online, you know, and are also buying homes unseen without actually seeing them in person. And technology and the ability to create dynamic content, the adoption of VR and AR and actually getting to virtually see a property has certainly catalyzed that as well. Now for us, I think, look, and people have asked in a tough environment 8% interest rates, obviously, right, there are changes going on right now and broker commissions, is that a difficult environment to build on? And I think, as you said, real estate, whether it’s residential, commercial, real estate investing, rental properties, ADUs, etc. All of these topics are still incredibly relevant, right, and are still at the core of our day to day lives. And so for us as a company, right, telling stories around real estate, we have to just be honest, right? We’re not going to go and say, We’re not going to create some type of market segment, right? That’s like buy a house right now in this area at an 8% interest rate, right? If the value is not there. For us, again, we have to talk about the business, right? Have the perspective of the realtor and the consumer, top of mind, and constantly, again, be at the forefront of what’s happening, right, and what’s changing in this business. But yeah, I mean, I think the thing that’s so interesting, as you say, real estate, but there are so many sectors, right and ways to talk about real estate, create content and tell stories around real estate. And so that’s what’s really exciting for us, we see so many possibilities, not just in residential, but with commercial and real estate investing, right? People looking again, at maybe it’s doing their first Airbnb, right? Maybe they want to invest in an apartment complex, right? Is this top of mind for so many people right now. And again, telling those stories across the entire industry for us is super compelling. And we found that there’s interest, irregardless of what the housing market looks like, right at any given time.

Kate 18:57
Well said. I mean, I almost feel like the whole core of this country is built on real estate and all the different facets around it. It’s so true. I mean, there’s just so many opportunities, and COVID changed it in some exciting ways. I know I made an offer on a home during COVID that I had never seen, never stepped foot in. I mean, we get it but you know, I mean, if you would’ve asked me that a few years before I would have said there’s no way but yeah, things are changing. And you know, what you’re doing with the Estate Media is perfect proof that with that, you know,

Griff 19:32
Thank you. No, I appreciate it. And look, you’re not alone. Right, so during COVID, and even today, right, looking at a property and you know, making an offer without actually seeing it. So it’s exciting. What’s going on in the business.

Kate 19:45
So as a founder, you know, and for the other founders listening, how is the whole fundraising journey been for you in this market? I mean, what you’re doing is so compelling, but it’s still a tough environment. To raise money.

Griff 20:01
Yeah, it’s difficult. And this is the first time that I’ve raised money for a business. Right, the last company I started we bootstrapped. And so fundraising was completely new to me. And so I think, you know, the lessons I learned to write in terms of institutional. first angel investors and who we go towards, again, was fairly new to me at the time. I think for us look, I mean, certainly a very difficult fundraising environment across the board. I think, too, you know, there’s always kind of the category that captures right investors, and is again, kind of at the core of the investor Zeitgeist. So right now that’s AI, during COVID, obviously, the Creator economy was incredibly buzzy. And I think we had somewhat of an uphill battle, right, and that you have seen a lot of large digital media companies, right, that raised up incredibly high valuations that might not have been substantiated, right, by the multiples they were raising at, again, that have gone out of business in the last year. And so for us, it was very much telling the story of how we were differentiated, how we were going to grow and grow profitably. Right. And I think today, especially for media companies, the environment five to 10 years ago was raise money / grow audience, right? Don’t focus on revenue or profitability, then raise more money once you had that audience, right? And think about scaling revenue and unit economics. And for us, right, I would say we don’t have that luxury, because that’s not the way that investors look at media today. But also, I think it is a blessing in disguise, right? Because we have to be more focused on growing perhaps, not again, with the velocity, because we’re not just putting money right into paid marketing, etc. But again, we have to grow with profitability in mind. And so for us telling that story, right, and being sober about the environment in which we’re raising, okay, it’s a tough advertising market as well, there were certainly headwinds. But I think for us as well, we had some incredible angel investors, right, who have built and sold media companies, thought leaders, right, and executives within real estate, who bought into the vision, right, and bought into our founding team, and saw the early traction that we had as a company in this market, which was incredibly helpful for us. And I think, look, if you can build today, in this media market advertising market, and also with real estate, right, in a difficult place with interest rates, and one of the most difficult real estate climates since 2008. You know, again, we’re building in a difficult time. And that presents challenges. But it’s really exciting. Also, right? Because if we can build today, I think we can build in any climate, right, in anything that comes forward to us, right, in terms of, you know, kind of what’s going on in the macro economic environment.

Kate 22:43
Absolutely. I mean, that’s so true. Because it’s, I like how you said it’s kind of forced you or made you be a little more focused right and deliberate about what you do versus five years ago, when people were just getting checks, right, and you just spending money, and you didn’t have kind of that focus. I mean, I bet this will end up being a good thing, because everything you do will be more deliberate. We always wrap up the show with just other general advice for the founders listening, that you’ve gleaned in, you know, in your experiences scaling Estate Media.

Griff 23:23
Yeah, look, I mean, it’s a very good question. You know, this is the second time I’m on an entrepreneurial journey now. And admittedly, with Estate, right, we’re still fairly early on, I think, the biggest thing for me, right, and, you know, the relative success we’ve had as a company, right, in the past year and a half has really been surrounding myself with people who are smarter, right, and more experienced than I. I know too as a young founder, that I need to surround myself with people, who have expertise, and I’ve seen things that I haven’t. And as a lot of our advisors, and investors would say they’ve had the years of experience to make mistakes, ideally, mistakes, right, that they can share that we as a company don’t make. And so I think, again, like, you know, I would not have been able to do this, right, without the team we have in the investors and advisors we have that, again, have more experience, right? And I’ve seen this been I’ve seen the successes and failures of companies in our space, and what makes founders right, and also teams successful.And so for me, again, I think, you know, the key is surrounding yourself with smart people who challenge you, and being receptive to feedback, right? Because I think it’s always that balance of starting something of having a vision, right? Doing something disruptive. And at the end of the day you have to make that decision and trust your gut in the data and what your customers are saying, but also getting feedback from multiple people right and making the most informed decision. So I guess that would be my little piece of advice, right? Just surround yourself with incredible people and I’ve been super fortunate that with Estate right in the for first year and a half of this business, we’ve certainly done that.

Kate 25:02
I think that’s a really powerful answer because I interview a lot of investors on this show. And when I asked them, you know, which startups which companies make it, yeah, they always say, you know, it’s the CEOs and founders that put a good team around them, good advisers around them. But then the second step to that is they actually listen and take the feedback and take the guidance and take the data points, like you just said, you know, you take the data, some founders are just like, No, this is it. I know it. I know it. And so I think that’s something very compelling that a lot of people should pay attention to, because I’ve now heard it from you. And on the investor side, it says a lot.

Griff 25:45
Yeah, you know, absolutely. I completely Yeah.

Kate 25:49
So for those listening, tell us how they can go find more information about estate media, you Yeah. As for those in the industry that want to be more involved with what you’re doing, give us all the details on how we can get more information?

Griff 26:06
Absolutely. Thank you for asking. Our website is EstateMedia.co. And you’ll find our newsletters, our video, and everything we’re doing on the podcast and education side as well. We’re on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, Tiktok, across all of the social platforms as well. And again, I think for advertisers, right, who want to work with us, you can do so through our website, or reach out to me. And I think, too, we’ve had so many amazing real estate creators post launch, who have seen what we’re doing, and have reached out whether that’s via Instagram or website or to me directly. And so I would encourage again, anyone, who’s in this business, who wants to learn more, who wants to create content, right, or is doing so and wants to be a part of an ecosystem, right, and ideally drive s cale quicker than they could themselves to certainly reach out, right, whether that’s to me directly or through our website.

Kate 26:59
That’s great. Thank you so much for sharing all that. It was a really fun conversation. I’m super impressed with what you all are doing seriously. I know we’re gonna see more and more big moves from Estate. So that’s very exciting. Thank you for being here today.

Griff 27:14
Yeah, thank you for having me. I enjoyed that.

27:17
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